Senior Democrats in US cities are preparing to defend their communities in the event ofĀ Donald Trumpā€™sĀ return to the White House after the former president has repeated threats that he would use presidential powers to seize control of major urban centers.

Trump has proposed deploying the military inside major cities largely run byĀ DemocratsĀ to deal with protesters or to crush criminal gangs. He has threatened to dispatch large numbers of federal immigration agents to carry out mass deportations of undocumented people in so-called ā€œsanctuaryā€ cities.

He also aims to obliterate the progressive criminal justice policies of left-leaning prosecutors.

ā€œIn cities where there has been a complete breakdown of law and order ā€¦ I will not hesitate to send in federal assets including the national guard until safety is restored,ā€ Trump says in the campaign platform for his bid to become the 47th US president,Ā Agenda47.

TrumpĀ provoked uproarĀ earlier this week when he called for US armed forces to be deployed against his political rivals ā€“ ā€œthe enemy withinā€ ā€“ on election day next month. But his plans to use national guard troops and military personnel as a means to attack those he sees as his opponents go much wider than that, spanning entire cities with Democratic leadership.

  • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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    2 months ago

    And this is why I am dumbfounded that the majority of the left is anti-2aā€¦the people who are gun owners unfortunately vote red, because theyā€™re single issue voters or Republicans. All the dems would need to do to completely destroy the GOP would be drop the anti2a rhetoric and theyā€™d sweep every election until the GOP died and another party came to compete.

    • TimmyDeanSausage @lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      I have never once heard an elected democratic politician (or serious candidate) speak against the 2nd amendment or even allude to repealing it. The only conversation I have personally seen/heard surrounding ā€œgun controlā€ is all about background checks/red flag laws which are supported by the majority of democratic and republican voters in every poll Iā€™ve seen. All of the so-called ā€œanti2aā€ rhetoric comes from the right in the form of fear mongering. That is to say (with no intention of being condescending), maybe stop listening to what right wing news outlets and politicians say Democratā€™s are saying and just listen to what democrats are actually sayingā€¦ You might be surprised at how sensible their ideas actually are on this issue.

      • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        I have never once heard an elected democratic politician (or serious candidate) speak against the 2nd amendment or even allude to repealing it.

        Youā€™reā€¦ youā€™re kidding right? The fuck are you talking aboutā€¦

        Thereā€™s literally an entire subreddit that documents every time a ban or confiscation comes up.

        https://old.reddit.com/r/NOWTTYG/

        You must be completely ignoring everything said on the Democrats side.

        The only conversation I have personally seen/heard surrounding ā€œgun controlā€ is all about background checks/red flag laws which are supported by the majority of democratic and republican voters in every poll Iā€™ve seen.

        Uhh noā€¦AWB, age limits, handgun bans, gun tax, mag limits, waiting periods, NFAā€¦ I could go on and on. You must not be from the USA if you think they only talk about BGC and ERPOs.

        All of the so-called ā€œanti2aā€ rhetoric comes from the right in the form of fear mongering. That is to say (with no intention of being condescending), maybe stop listening to what right wing news outlets and politicians say Democratā€™s are saying and just listen to what democrats are actually sayingā€¦ You might be surprised at how sensible their ideas actually are on this issue.

        I love how you immediately think Iā€™m listening to right wing garbage. You do know there are a large and growing amount of left leaning people who are gun owners now right? Trump admin helped increase that number tenfold. You might want to read more into what you think the dems are saying, because itā€™s not just ERPOs and BGCsā€¦

    • Olgratin_Magmatoe@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      Itā€™s almost like having guns freely and widely accessible with few restrictions leads to a lot of death and injury, and the group with higher empathy has a problem with that.

        • chaogomu@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          No gun crime, that can be said quite easily. Or at least the numbers of shootings are small enough that they make international news when they happen.

          And also, the cops in those countries tend not to shoot people or pets. Like ever. Cases where an officer is forced to discharge their weapon are also international news stories.

          But here in the states, we wouldnā€™t know any of that, because here there are two or three mass shootings per day.

          Just let that dichotomy sink in a bit.

          • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            No gun crime, that can be said quite easily. Or at least the numbers of shootings are small enough that they make international news when they happen.

            These countries also have safety nets and generally give a shit about their citizens. The usa doesnā€™t have any of that.

            And also, the cops in those countries tend not to shoot people or pets. Like ever. Cases where an officer is forced to discharge their weapon are also international news stories.

            We need to end qualified immunity here big time. Also something other countries(western) donā€™t have. 1 in 38ish deaths via firearms are from police. Thatā€™s including suicides which account for 66% of all gun deaths in the usa.

            But here in the states, we wouldnā€™t know any of that, because here there are two or three mass shootings per day.

            No there is not. This is the issue with data from the anti2a crowd, itā€™s like talking to the anti-abortion groupsā€¦made up and fully exaggerated shit.

              • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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                2 months ago

                Donā€™t know how many times Iā€™ve got to say this but the GVA is junk data.

                Here is one from the 2024 listā€¦it states 1 dead 9 injuredā€¦but if you go to the article referenced you have to go to another to see thatā€¦gang shooting surpriseā€¦

                https://www.wsmv.com/2024/10/14/police-say-five-people-involved-jefferson-street-mass-shooting-had-gang-affiliations/

                Even better is the 9 people injured, were injured after the shooting, and not from the gun fire(usually crowds panic and people get hurt from running). So no not what should be considered a mass shooting but itā€™s there because of some bullshit definition. The public hears mass shooting and thinks random person shot up a mallā€¦not ā€œgang members got into a fight and shot each otherā€

                • chaogomu@lemmy.world
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                  2 months ago

                  Are you saying that a gang shooting isnā€™t a mass shooting? Why? Are they not people?

                  In countries with sensible gun laws, the gangs donā€™t have guns.

                  The gangs still exist, because weā€™re humans, but they donā€™t have easy guns and thus, there are no mass shootings,

                  • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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                    2 months ago

                    Are you saying that a gang shooting isnā€™t a mass shooting? Why? Are they not people?

                    No itā€™s not what the public thinks of a mass shooting. You can stop pretending it is.

                    In countries with sensible gun laws, the gangs donā€™t have guns.

                    In countries with sensible gun laws ā€¦they never had 400+ million firearms in civ hands to startā€¦they also arenā€™t running a war on drugs that creates gangs like oursā€¦we literally created the cartels from our war on drugs.

                    The gangs still exist, because weā€™re humans, but they donā€™t have easy guns and thus, there are no mass shootings,

                    The gangs in other Western countries are like bikers gangs that go to ihop here in the statesā€¦ theyā€™re a fuckin joke.

              • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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                2 months ago

                Donā€™t know how many times Iā€™ve got to say this but the GVA is junk data.

                Here is one from the 2024 listā€¦it states 1 dead 9 injuredā€¦but if you go to the article referenced you have to go to another to see thatā€¦gang shooting surpriseā€¦

                https://www.wsmv.com/2024/10/14/police-say-five-people-involved-jefferson-street-mass-shooting-had-gang-affiliations/

                Even better is the 9 people injured, were injured after the shooting, and not from the gun fire(usually crowds panic and people get hurt from running). So no not what should be considered a mass shooting but itā€™s there because of some bullshit definition. The public hears mass shooting and thinks random person shot up a mallā€¦not ā€œgang members got into a fight and shot each otherā€

        • sorval_the_eeter@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          idiot, other places without firears have far less, and taking away of guns always lowers the violence. You have no idea what you are talking about.

          • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            Yes far less firearm deaths. Not less crime or other deathsā€¦ itā€™s a reason London had a higher knife homicide rate than NYC at one point. It also helps that those other places have safety nets and support their citizens.

      • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        If they had the ability to repeal the 2nd, they would. The end goal is alway complete removal. Letā€™s stop acting like its not.

          • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            I never understood why itā€™s something that Dems want to hide. There is a pretty damn large portion that want to repeal the 2nd.

            https://time.com/5216782/john-paul-stevens-repeal-second-amendment/

            https://newrepublic.com/article/166628/democrats-repeal-second-amendment-guns

            https://www.congress.gov/bill/103rd-congress/house-joint-resolution/81

            https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/09/opinions/gun-reform-second-amendment-repeal-uvalde-shooting-press/index.html

            https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/repeal-second-amendment-gun-control/

            https://www.amazon.com/Repeal-Second-Amendment-Safer-America/dp/1250244404

            https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/national-firearms-act

            https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a19608552/major-owens-second-amendment-repeal/

            https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2019/bills/SCR42_.pdf

            https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/columnist/2022/07/11/jayland-walker-highland-park-uvalde-second-amendment/7809531001/?gnt-cfr=1&gca-cat=p

            Because the poll has somehow vanishedā€¦

            https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/one-in-five-americans-wants-the-second-amendment-to-be-repealed-national-survey-finds/

            In February, for instance, the Economist and YouGov asked Americans whether they supported a repeal of the Second Amendment. Just 21 percent said they favored such a proposal, compared to 60 percent in opposition.

            The poll does, however, show surprisingly robust support for Second Amendment repeal (39 percent) among Democrats (by contrast just 8 percent of Republicans would support a full repeal).

            So can we stop pretending that support to repeal and ban all guns isnā€™t something that is the end goal?

            • Maggoty@lemmy.world
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              2 months ago

              Lmao, throwing the kitchen sink at us and hoping we wonā€™t check the details?

              1. Retired Supreme Court Judge

              2. Opinion article saying Democrats should, by a staff writer

              3. A House Bill from 20 years ago with no co-sponsors, that didnā€™t even make it out of committee.

              4. A Podcasterā€™s opinion article

              5. Opinion article saying Democrats should, by a staff writer

              6. College Professor wrote a book

              7. The law saying you canā€™t have fully automatic weapons, (LMFAO, really? you think thatā€™s a repeal of the second?)

              8. An article about the the representative from number 3, who again, acted alone, admitted he acted without party support, and admitted it was little more than a political stunt. Thank you for giving us the first real evidence that Democrats are not trying to ban guns or repeal the second.

              9. Some state legislators asking for a clarifying amendment. Which, (checks notes), yup completely ignored by the party.

              10. A paywalled opinion piece by a staff writer.

              11. Your Seattle Times article puts those numbers in the correct light, because 39 percent isnā€™t a majority or anywhere near enough to force action on the national level.

              But public-opinion polling shows it would take a lot of persuading to bring the public around to that view. In February, for instance, the Economist and YouGov asked Americans whether they supported a repeal of the Second Amendment. Just 21 percent said they favored such a proposal, compared to 60 percent in opposition.

              So no. The answer is no. Because despite using eleven sources you could not find any evidence the democrats are actually trying to ban all guns. Even if we repealed the second amendment it wouldnā€™t ban all guns, it would just open the opportunity to regulate them.

              I will however say that every time the GOP offers thoughts and prayers over the bodies of children, that number grows and once it reaches a tipping point a ban will be inevitable and there will be no glorious civil war because support will just be that high. If the GOP backed off for even a second and allowed red flag laws and universal background check, and had their state AGs prosecute those laws then there would be less shit for law abiding gun owners to wade through. Which is why 75 percent of Americans support Universal Background Check and Gun Licensing. The country is still willing to work with you, that may not be true in a another decade with a hundred more high profile mass casualty events at schools.

              • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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                2 months ago

                Lmao, throwing the kitchen sink at us and hoping we wonā€™t check the details?

                ? You asked for sources, I provided them and you complainā€¦way to start out.

                1. Retired Supreme Court Judge

                A democrat appointed judge. Guess he doesnā€™t count some how.

                1. Opinion article saying Democrats should, by a staff writer

                Ah yea another Democrat that doesnā€™t countā€¦got it.

                1. A House Bill from 20 years ago with no co-sponsors, that didnā€™t even make it out of committee.

                Soā€¦a bill from a Democratā€¦but doesnā€™t countā€¦this is going to be a trend with you isnā€™t it?

                1. A Podcasterā€™s opinion article

                Another Democrat that doesnā€™t countā€¦

                1. Opinion article saying Democrats should, by a staff writer

                Yep definitely a trendā€¦

                1. College Professor wrote a book

                A democrat got itā€¦ doesnā€™t count

                1. The law saying you canā€™t have fully automatic weapons, (LMFAO, really? you think thatā€™s a repeal of the second?)

                I forgot how death by 1000 cuts doesnā€™t countā€¦you sound like a anti-abortion mouth piece saying abortion can still be had in other states, but itā€™s fine to be banned in red ones.

                1. An article about the the representative from number 3, who again, acted alone, admitted he acted without party support, and admitted it was little more than a political stunt. Thank you for giving us the first real evidence that Democrats are not trying to ban guns or repeal the second.

                Sooo yepā€¦ doesnā€™t count because theyā€™re not true Democrats? I hear this a lot from Republicans when they try and refute pointsā€¦

                1. Some state legislators asking for a clarifying amendment. Which, (checks notes), yup completely ignored by the party.

                Soā€¦(Checks notes) Not a real Democratā€¦got it.

                1. A paywalled opinion piece by a staff writer.

                Another not real democratā€¦man you really think very few people are Democrats.

                1. Your Seattle Times article puts those numbers in the correct light, because 39 percent isnā€™t a majority or anywhere near enough to force action on the national level.

                So 39% arenā€™t real Democrats is what youā€™re saying?

                So no. The answer is no. Because despite using eleven sources you could not find any evidence the democrats are actually trying to ban all guns. Even if we repealed the second amendment it wouldnā€™t ban all guns, it would just open the opportunity to regulate them.

                Got it no real Democratsā€¦

                I will however say that every time the GOP offers thoughts and prayers over the bodies of children, that number grows and once it reaches a tipping point a ban will be inevitable and there will be no glorious civil war because support will just be that high.

                Why are we talking about the shit stains in the GOP?

                If the GOP backed off for even a second and allowed red flag laws and universal background check, and had their state AGs prosecute those laws then there would be less shit for law abiding gun owners to wade through.

                You do realize a good chunk of the GOP supports ERPOs right? But again why are we talking about the GOP? That wasnā€™t your question.

                Which is why 75 percent of Americans support Universal Background Check and Gun Licensing. The country is still willing to work with you, that may not be true in a another decade with a hundred more high profile mass casualty events at schools.

                Weā€™ve had 15 mass shootings in schools since Columbineā€¦ weā€™re going to need to have way more each year to get to 100 in under a decade. UBC requires a registery, but most people are to stupid to know thisā€¦and gun licensing is a joke.

                None of that is going to stop or even dent gun deaths in this country.

                • Maggoty@lemmy.world
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                  2 months ago

                  If I have to acknowledge everyone who self identifies as a democrat then you have to acknowledge the Republicans and pro 2A groups are terrorists who should be hunted down and renditioned. After all, weā€™re counting what every single person who self identifies with the group says right? Not their actual platform or actions?

                  • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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                    2 months ago

                    If I have to acknowledge everyone who self identifies as a democrat then you have to acknowledge the Republicans and pro 2A groups are terrorists who should be hunted down and renditioned.

                    Lol wait wait youā€™re suggesting that people who own guns and are pro2a are terrorists? Lol the fuck is wrong with you.

                    After all, weā€™re counting what every single person who self identifies with the group says right? Not their actual platform or actions?

                    Lol you literally cannot fathom that there is a good chunk of the Democratic party that would ban all guns if they had the chance lol

                    PS suggesting that the repubs are pro2a is hilarious.

            • Bytemeister@lemmy.world
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              2 months ago

              39% support among Democrats. Not all Democrats, not a plurality, and not even a majority.

              Two of those fucking links went to the same stupid bill from 1994 that a handful of people put forward as an alternative to the assault weapons ban, and one of them is goddamn sticker on Amazon. You really are grasping at straws here.

              I can understand the appeal for repealing the 2nd amendment, since a lot of people consider it too vague to have any real meaning, and the conservative loaded SC has determined that ā€œwell regulated militiaā€ extends to groups of racist hilljacks in a pickup shooting unarmed black men.

              That being said thoughā€¦ 39% of Dems oppose it, which means that the Democratic party as a whole is 61% in favor of keeping it.

              So, are you gonna take the L and delete your comment, or are you gonna post another wall of bullshit that you didnā€™t even bother to read before calling it gospel and spreading it over the fediverse?

              • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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                2 months ago

                39% support among Democrats. Not all Democrats, not a plurality, and not even a majority.

                So those %39 arenā€™t really Democrats? Got itā€¦

                Two of those fucking links went to the same stupid bill from 1994 that a handful of people put forward as an alternative to the assault weapons ban, and one of them is goddamn sticker on Amazon. You really are grasping at straws here.

                Lol no theyā€™re not, and the Amazon link is for a book from a Democratā€¦but okā€¦

                I can understand the appeal for repealing the 2nd amendment, since a lot of people consider it too vague to have any real meaning, and the conservative loaded SC has determined that ā€œwell regulated militiaā€ extends to groups of racist hilljacks in a pickup shooting unarmed black men.

                Yea noā€¦ itā€™s only people who are antigun that find it vagueā€¦ itā€™s got commas and states two things. The people should be able to bear arms and that the militia should existā€¦ because at that time both sides considered a standing army to be a no goā€¦so history tells us itā€™s not vagueā€¦ just antigun groups do.

                That being said thoughā€¦ 39% of Dems oppose it, which means that the Democratic party as a whole is 61% in favor of keeping it.

                Lolā€¦yea cause 39% is so little.

                So, are you gonna take the L and delete your comment, or are you gonna post another wall of bullshit that you didnā€™t even bother to read before calling it gospel and spreading it over the fediverse?

                You mean are you going to keep whining because you donā€™t know history and think dems are pro2a?

                • Bytemeister@lemmy.world
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                  2 months ago

                  So those %39 arenā€™t really Democrats? Got itā€¦

                  Strawman argument. My counter-point as a whole was not that everyone wants to keep the 2nd Amendment, but that Democrats do not want to repeal the 2nd amendment. It has less than 50% support in the party. To further express why you are attacking a strawmanā€¦

                  So those %8 arenā€™t really Republicans? Got itā€¦

                  Yea noā€¦ itā€™s only people who are antigun that find it vagueā€¦

                  I think the only people who find it straight-forward believe that any number of mass shootings, school shootings and random shootings is acceptable, as long as there are no more restrictions of any kind on their ability to purchase, sell, and use any weapon.

                  Also, most constitutional law scholars who had fucking doctorates in this shit find it vague.

                  Lolā€¦yea cause 39% is so little.

                  Still <50%ā€¦ Lol?

                  You mean are you going to keep whining because you donā€™t know history and think dems are pro2a?

                  Are you acting like you do know the history of 2A movents in the US? Donā€™t make me laugh.

                  Anymore bullshit opinions pieces and Amazon links you want to spam here as ā€œevidenceā€?

                  • SupraMario@lemmy.world
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                    2 months ago

                    Strawman argument. My counter-point as a whole was not that everyone wants to keep the 2nd Amendment, but that Democrats do not want to repeal the 2nd amendment. It has less than 50% support in the party. To further express why you are attacking a strawmanā€¦

                    Thatā€™s not what a strawman argument is, the original user stated that no dems want to ban the 2nd, I have clearly provided sources that state this is bullshit.

                    So those %8 arenā€™t really Republicans? Got itā€¦

                    This is a strawman, as itā€™s not part of the original argument.

                    I think the only people who find it straight-forward believe that any number of mass shootings, school shootings and random shootings is acceptable, as long as there are no more restrictions of any kind on their ability to purchase, sell, and use any weapon.

                    Heyā€¦ another strawmanā€¦

                    Also, most constitutional law scholars who had fucking doctorates in this shit find it vague.

                    Yea no they donā€™t, unless theyā€™re antigun, then it magically becomes vague.

                    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

                    Here there is an entire section dor scholarly comments.

                    Still <50%ā€¦ Lol?

                    Lol yea cause 1/3rd is a tiny amountā€¦also straw man.

                    Are you acting like you do know the history of 2A movents in the US? Donā€™t make me laugh.

                    Lol sure thing, I donā€™t know what Iā€™m talking about.

                    Anymore bullshit opinions pieces and Amazon links you want to spam here as ā€œevidenceā€?

                    Ah left leaning sources that disagree with you are now ā€¦bullshitā€¦damn

        • Yeller_king@reddthat.com
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          2 months ago

          If we ever have the ability to repeal the 2A then the GOP is already in shambles and weā€™ll have the opportunity to make all kinds of other reforms that makes it impossible for them to recover.