• SatanicNotMessianic@lemmy.ml
      686·
      11 months ago

      I only see this argument made by conservatives. It is a deliberate attempt to drive a racist and LGBT-phobic wedge between the white working class and the Democratic Party. I have never seen a progressive person demand less support for the rights of minorities.

      I also favor raising the minimum wage, making universities free to attend, and having universal healthcare - but LGBT rights aren’t the reason we don’t have those things. The GOP is the reason we don’t have those things, and it’s not like if the Dems said “Fuck it, arrest and kill the gays” that the GOP would suddenly support workers’ rights.

      If you want to help the poor, vote out the party that says shit like this.

      • Transporter Room 3@startrek.website
        174·
        11 months ago

        Conservatives, and useful idiots.

        The only people I see claiming both sides are the same are people who have interest in either democrats failing as a party, or the whole country failing and collapsing in general.

    • Murvel@lemm.ee
      1956·
      11 months ago

      Mhm of course! Third year into the Democrat administration and wealth inequality in the US keep reaching new staggering heights.

      • NABDad@lemmy.worldEnglish
        375·
        11 months ago

        Hmmm … and which party is running the House of Representatives that had the record for getting less done than any other in the history of the country?

        • Murvel@lemm.ee
          529·
          11 months ago

          You keep telling yourselves; it’s the other teams fault! All the while the situation is only geting worse and worse for the working class

          • ryry1985@lemmy.world
            165·
            11 months ago

            That’s exactly what you’ve done in the first place. A lot of these issues you all do this over are not even short term issues but long term ones that no single administration has that much control over. Stop with the BS hyperbole and actually think for your damn self. We are living in a pseudo democracy masking a plutocracy. You’re too busy playing their game so we won’t unite. They keep getting richer while the rest of us suffer and fight over stupid shit.

  • madcaesar@lemmy.world
    9013·
    11 months ago

    You know who posts boTh sIdEs memes? Republicans trying to distract you from the shit they are doing.

  • fmstrat@lemmy.nowsci.comEnglish
    543·
    11 months ago

    It’s sad to see this up voted so much right under an article about democrats trying to provide free community college.

    • nifty@lemmy.worldOP
      1913·
      11 months ago

      I feel bad for posting this now because I wasn’t trying to make false equivalencies. Unequivocally, I find that someone identifying as a Democrat politician is more likely to be progressive and humanitarian than one identifying as a Republican politician.

      I am not sure the demeanor of the Democratic Party in general has anything to do with intrinsic ideology because many party members used to be against gay marriage in the 90s. It’s a good thing that one party (Democrats) is open to changing itself according to public will, which is what you’d want in a representative democracy.

      What this means to me is that you shouldn’t take party demeanors for granted, and keep pushing for the change you want.

      Edit: so yeah, if you don’t want four years of conservatives breaking all progressive pillars of society, go out and fucking vote!!

  • Son_of_dad@lemmy.world
    5212·
    11 months ago

    Election time, so of course there’s these “both sides” bullshit posts that will try to tell you that Donald Trump is somehow the better choice, cause he at least stares you in the eyes while he fucks you.

    • Zoboomafoo@slrpnk.net
      181·
      11 months ago

      I take it back, that poor unionist on the right is about to receive a maximum power Biden Blast

    • Fades@lemmy.world
      91·
      11 months ago

      the only president to ever join the picket lines alongside unionized citizens

      • chuckleslord@lemmy.world
        291·
        11 months ago

        And then got them the sick days they were looking for after all of it. Listen, I don’t agree with strike busting, but going back after to get the workers what they need is laudable. His brain is rotted by neoliberalism, but he is trying.

        I have no idea what tone I’m trying to convey here, and I find that funny.

      • Son_of_dad@lemmy.world
        17·
        11 months ago

        You’re forgetting that Republicans have NEVER supported unions and would jail every pro union worker if they could. Biden being anti union is suddenly the same as every Republican ever being anti union?

        • Mario_Dies.wav@lemmy.dbzer0.com
          42·
          11 months ago

          No, but I sure wish we had better choices. It’s like someone giving you a choice between a meal of poison and one of shit logs.

          I’ll vote, but can’t say I feel too great about our shitty system that leads us to such a dark place.

      • Fades@lemmy.world
        72·
        11 months ago

        we didn’t get everything ever so it’s bad!!!

        Give me a fucking break

        • Wogi@lemmy.world
          31·
          11 months ago

          I’d rather the rail workers got a break but apparently Joe didn’t agree.

    • bdonvr@thelemmy.club
      121·
      11 months ago

      Right, we need to be organizing, protesting, and working to destroy the current power structure.

      • graveyardchickenhunt@lemmy.world
        334·
        11 months ago

        Criticizing is great, putting it like OP with “they’re the same, democrats just put on a hat” is dishonest and reductionist. This kind of thing actively causes harm and plays into the hands of the party that’s objectively worse for anyone that’s not rich.

        • Rikudou_Sage@lemmings.world
          107·
          11 months ago

          Criticizing is great, putting it like OP with “they’re the same, democrats just put on a hat” is dishonest and reductionist.

          It’s really not. My favourite example is Roe v. Wade - how long did democrats have to fix it? How long did they use it in their campaigns in the lines of “if you don’t vote democrats, republicans will overturn it”?

          Yeah, they’re the better choice, for sure, but they’re not a good choice.

          • graveyardchickenhunt@lemmy.world
            75·
            11 months ago

            And your own words show exactly what I mean.

            There’s a marked difference between lazy fucks who didn’t properly bring it across the finish line and people actively working to make things worse. Correct my believe if I’m wrong: unless it’s a constitutional amendment, laws are fairly easy to overturn still.

            And to ‘how many years’… How many years did people have to vote for progressive candidates in the lower levels to change the actual base of the party to where they want it to be? How many years have the voters not used to make it the party they want it to be?

            This kinda shit is so fucking often due to progressives wanting things to be a certain way, but not putting in the legwork because “it’s a lost cause anyway”. With the democrats you have a chance to change the party into the progressive direction. Take an example from those maga assholes - it doesn’t take a lot of them to shift the republicans to be even worse.

            • Kentifer@lemmy.world
              75·
              11 months ago

              This argument would be fine if the DNC actually let people select progressive candidates. But they almost never do. The DNC is controlled by committee, not by democracy, ironically.

              • graveyardchickenhunt@lemmy.world
                41·
                11 months ago

                And who do they draw from? The active base. If the complaints are loud enough, broad enough, from inside the party, that’s when they will have no choice.

                “Oh there’s the dnc, can’t do anything, move on” is not a productive way to fight these things.

                • Kentifer@lemmy.world
                  23·
                  11 months ago

                  Neither is “The other side is worse, guess the DNC gets to do whatever the fuck they want.” If I only have two choices, then I’m going to be loud and annoying when those choices aren’t acceptable to me. I don’t care what you say.

            • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.worldEnglish
              11·
              11 months ago

              There’s a marked difference between lazy fucks who didn’t properly bring it across the finish line and people actively working to make things worse.

              Yes, there’s a difference between perpetrators and bystanders who can help but choose not to.

              But the bystanders keep expecting praise for helping when they haven’t.

          • graveyardchickenhunt@lemmy.world
            112·
            11 months ago

            No shit, Sherlock. And that’s why you’re helping the fascists with this comparison. You’re working in a two party system, being an idiot about how to actually change shit.

            You’re not changing the one party that can be used for change for the better, you’re just whining and making them seek votes elsewhere.

      • theonyltruemupf@feddit.de
        201·
        11 months ago

        US citizens need to destroy the first past the post voting system. It’s fucked and undemocratic and it needs to be replaced.

        • Square Singer@feddit.de
          5·
          11 months ago

          The problem is that only people who came into power using the current system would have a chance to change the system. And why would anyone want to change the system that brought them to power?

          • Timwi@kbin.social
            4·
            11 months ago

            This is broadly true, but it’s not completely unheard-of for systems to change despite this.

              • Timwi@kbin.social
                2·
                11 months ago

                Yeah, unfortunately. But let’s think positive! How many such events in history can we think of that went relatively violence-free? I can think of two off the top of my head:

                1. The end of apartheid in South Africa. All they did was to force them to free Nelson Mandela, who then promptly got elected. No major government overthrow.

                2. East Germany. After the fateful press conference that caused everyone to storm the border crossings, the government basically accepted that their economy could no longer hold up, and they disbanded without a fight.

                3. Honorable mention: The disbanding of the Soviet Union within Russia. There have certainly been violent revolutions in the other socialist republics, but Russia didn’t need one because Yeltsin could just declare Russia independent from the Soviet Union.

                Are there others I missed?

                • Square Singer@feddit.de
                  1·
                  11 months ago

                  All of these happened in the wake of major crises.

                  Apartheit in South Africa ended, because of massive protests in the country (including violence), massive international pressure (the UN labelled apartheit as crime against humanity and lots of countries banned imports from South Africa), and the South African economy was collapsing due the price of gold dropping a lot.

                  East Germany collapsed because of massive economic problems. Storming the border crossings was just the last push. If that would have happened 10 years earlier, the police would just have shot the first row of people trying to cross the border and the rest would have fled. The DDR was already collapsing at that point. And the press conference that caused the storm on the border crossing was actually about East Germany opening the border in a month’s time. So even without the storm on the border crossings, the same thing would have happend, just a month later.

                  The Sovjet Union, again, collapsed due to economic problems. Their economiy completely collapsed and with it their power over all the different SSRs. Russia, being the largest and most powerful SSR, being able declaring itself independent of all these other countries that really didn’t want to be part of the USSR without having to use violence is really not surprising.

                  It’s kinda as if Great Brittain declared itself independent of the Brittish Empire.

                  All these situations you mentioned where already under way for a decade or so, before the events you mentioned did the last push. And all of them where only possible to massive crises.

          • theonyltruemupf@feddit.de
            3·
            11 months ago

            I’m not sure I get you point.

            This article is very US centric and it only talks about (the obvious) flaws in the US system. Other democracies might not be perfect, but many don’t have the problems mentioned there.

            We could completely abolish any system of government, but cooperating in societies of thousands and millions of people would be close to impossible.

    • sic_1@feddit.de
      1414·
      11 months ago

      That’s what happens when you only have the choice between neo liberal and extreme right.

  • Fades@lemmy.world
    164·
    11 months ago

    This is fucking dumb as hell, rainbow capitalism is the fucking tip not the whole goddamn iceberg.

    This is just another braindead “both sides” meme