I don’t really consider a malicious app to be an exploit. In this case, the software is doing exactly what it was designed to do – malicious activity. It’s not being manipulated to perform unintended operations through the exploitation of a software bug. Code signing and secure boot are not effective in the face of intentionally shipping malicious code to end users. It’s designed to frustrate actual hackers.
For malicious-by-design apps, we rely on a central app store that hopefully reduces the number of bad apps in circulation. If you publish malware, eventually you get caught and we know who you are. Sandboxing with a permissions system helps prevent apps from performing actions contrary to the user’s interests. E.g. why is my flashlight app asking for my contacts when I pressed ‘change color?’
If you directly exploit your way in, it’s harder to know who did this and why because you didn’t go through any central vetting or accountability system, and you’re not so easily bound by the permissions system. It depends on what your bad guy’s goals are, what they want, whom they’re targeting. Force your way in the back entrance, crawl through an open window (like a weak security setting), or lie your way in the front door (trojan)? It depends.
None of it is perfect, but I’m sure OS design experts would love to hear about better solutions if any exist.
wouldn’t a malicious app still be an exploit though? I’d say that if I download an app for playing a game, but instead it was designed to also upload my private photos to the attacker’s server, i’d say that’s still exploiting. It’s just exploiting my expectations of what the app should do, rather than leveraging a system weakness (which it probably does, anyway)
You’d have to grant the app permission to access your photos. At this point, I would say the problem is more the person in the driver’s seat. You can’t really protect the user from themselves. If you had a legitimate reason to grant access to your photos, then we definitely have a problem.
You can think of this as a kind of exploit if you prefer. However, this becomes a permissions and ecosystem and reputation issue and not really a technical software one. Because you’re looking at a totally different set of tools, I think it’s useful to restrict exploit to refer only to bugs.
You could take that argument one step further and ask what if my new phone comes with preinstalled malware? The system collapses if you can’t have some level of trust the software you’re running.
I don’t really consider a malicious app to be an exploit. In this case, the software is doing exactly what it was designed to do – malicious activity. It’s not being manipulated to perform unintended operations through the exploitation of a software bug. Code signing and secure boot are not effective in the face of intentionally shipping malicious code to end users. It’s designed to frustrate actual hackers.
For malicious-by-design apps, we rely on a central app store that hopefully reduces the number of bad apps in circulation. If you publish malware, eventually you get caught and we know who you are. Sandboxing with a permissions system helps prevent apps from performing actions contrary to the user’s interests. E.g. why is my flashlight app asking for my contacts when I pressed ‘change color?’
If you directly exploit your way in, it’s harder to know who did this and why because you didn’t go through any central vetting or accountability system, and you’re not so easily bound by the permissions system. It depends on what your bad guy’s goals are, what they want, whom they’re targeting. Force your way in the back entrance, crawl through an open window (like a weak security setting), or lie your way in the front door (trojan)? It depends.
None of it is perfect, but I’m sure OS design experts would love to hear about better solutions if any exist.
Your explanations really are poetry.
Aww, thank you!
wouldn’t a malicious app still be an exploit though? I’d say that if I download an app for playing a game, but instead it was designed to also upload my private photos to the attacker’s server, i’d say that’s still exploiting. It’s just exploiting my expectations of what the app should do, rather than leveraging a system weakness (which it probably does, anyway)
You’d have to grant the app permission to access your photos. At this point, I would say the problem is more the person in the driver’s seat. You can’t really protect the user from themselves. If you had a legitimate reason to grant access to your photos, then we definitely have a problem.
You can think of this as a kind of exploit if you prefer. However, this becomes a permissions and ecosystem and reputation issue and not really a technical software one. Because you’re looking at a totally different set of tools, I think it’s useful to restrict exploit to refer only to bugs.
You could take that argument one step further and ask what if my new phone comes with preinstalled malware? The system collapses if you can’t have some level of trust the software you’re running.