Sadly, statistics sort of tend to back up at least a few of those claims, even if it is a silly cartoon. Even if people do not like to admit it. Example, in 2018, 69% of black mothers are single mothers. But people never want to speak about reality because they have been told that speaking about reality is somehow racist, which is not. No problem ever gets fixed if people refuse to look at it, honestly.
“In 2011, 72% of black babies were born to unmarried mothers,[5][6] while the 2018 National Vital Statistics Report provides a figure of 69.4 percent for this condition.” The stats have not gotten better since then.
Around half of the US population has hypertension.
I’m guessing you wouldn’t want your doctor just assuming you have it and start treating it though.
The reason why stereotypes are bad is because even if there’s aggregate data trends on a broad population basis, that doesn’t necessarily translate to individualized specifics.
In my high school, I was in Calculus BC in my senior year, along with most of the other smartest kids in my grade.
One of the few black students at my prep school had been in that class in his junior year and for his senior year just sat one on one with the math teacher because he was a full year ahead of us. He was also the student that I used to get the most competitive with playing chess in the student lounge (because he was legit better than me and the few victories I’d eek out were actual accomplishments), and was the one of my friends to go off to Stanford.
It’d be a real shame if someone looking at him decided that based on broad statistics relating to the melanin in his skin that he wasn’t as good at math as someone with less melanin.
And personally, I’d think anyone making that leap of logic was a goddamn moron.
(Also, pro tip - it’s worth thinking about the differences between averages and distributions around those averages if you are going to make an argument for there being merit in extrapolating from statistics. For example, you are more likely to be told by a mother with a child that the father is not in the picture by a white mother than a black mother if you ask the question of every mother you see.)
Around half of the US population has hypertension.
I’m guessing you wouldn’t want your doctor just assuming you have it and start treating it though.
I have to disagree with a reply to this before me because I think this example doesn’t do the comment about statistics mentioned above justice.
You don’t want your doctor to treat you for hypertension, but you want him to check you for it to catch it early if you have it if you fall into a category that makes it more likely you have hypertension. This does not mean he should ignore the possibility of a disease in a non-high-risk group either.
Equally, black students being statistically speaking worse at math does not mean you should look at a black student and assume he is bad in math. But it can mean that funding for programs targeted at helping minority students going to math tutoring can be better justified.
I will not argue that based on statistics you should make assumptions about people, hell no. This is obviously racist. But assuming statistics (and being aware of them) are first and foremost racist would just be equally wrong.
The phrasings in the meme can be described as racist. But the structural problems that racism created and that lead to these assumptions cannot be fought by ignoring them.
But it can mean that funding for programs targeted at helping minority students going to math tutoring can be better justified.
But this ignores the issue of frequency I hint at in the bottom parenthetical.
Let’s say for the sake of argument black students are 2x as likely as white students to fail a math class and need to retake it.
Breaking it out by racial cross tabs may well suggest a policy of adding a math support program exclusively for black students.
The problem is that at a frequency basis, (0.616 times X) > (0.121 times 2X). So your well intentioned program just excluded a greater number of students that are going to fail math than the number of students you are going to include.
A better approach would be to identify what students are struggling with math irrespective of their melanin, and ensure adequate resources are tailored to them.
The only way a melanin specific math program makes sense is if the specific factors relating to why a given student is struggling with math is unique to their melanin such that a broader program focused on math won’t address those issues.
But even in terms of unique causes or factors, my guess is that the melanin specific crosstab is a poor metric selection, as it simply correlates with multiple other factors which more closely track with performance, such as household income levels, parent availability at home, parent education levels, etc.
So a program that was focused instead on things like “math support for kids who don’t have a parent who has high school math level competency at home” is going to be much more successful for many more students than one focused on “students with a lot of melanin who are struggling with math.”
It’s a shitty metric that persists because it’s easy to classify and because for some things it is a causative factor in and of itself (such as criminal injustice).
I’m not sure but I don’t think the point is statistics. I think the point is to treat everyone equally despite the colour of their skin until you know them personally, and their situation.
Your quote doesn’t support your claim. 69% of black mothers being unmarried does not mean they’re single mothers. It definitely correlates, but one doesn’t mean the other.
Your choice of wording is odd, like “problem”, and “better.” I am 30 years old. I have been with my partner for 15 years, and we have an 8 and a 6 year old child together. We live together in our 4 bedroom home. Yes, we are black. No, there is no struggle associated with us being unmarried.
In the US, there are legal and financial advantages to marrying your partner. It sounds like you’re in it for the long haul so it’s worth thinking about.
Have a chat about it with your lawyer or accountant, they’ll make the case much better than I can.
Statistics show that white people are more likely to develop skin cancer than other racial groups. Would that problem be fixed by asking every white person you meet who has mole on their face if they have skin cancer?
To expand a little I feel it’s more that people do not understand racism appropriately rather than not wanting to speak about reality. People, ironically, fear being labeled. For most racism is blatant and obvious. A “do not say or do these specific things” mentality. This leads to the misunderstanding. The reality (as you say) is we should acknowledge racism. By acting like it isn’t there we are doing a disservice to the people who are affected by the systemic issues that do exist.
In the U.S. this is very much a larger cultural issue, while also being a problem elsewhere in the world. If I had to guess: Cultures with stronger authoritarian leanings in significant sub-cultures such as work and familial structures also see stronger racism or similar beliefs on the same tree. How is this fought? Humility and acknowledgement.
Agreed. But I wonder if this is butting up against a limitation of the human brain. Every person across the globe experiences stereotypes. It seems to be a natural way the human brain forms initial judgements. Hell, I don’t think the comic artist realized they were making a stereotype when they made all the questions askers white.
Being aware of it helps but the best fix is to have a significant amount of personal time with the group in question. This is why it’s so frustrating for someone of a particular race to hear questions like this, because they have plenty of first hand experience with members of their race. Themselves, their family, etc…
But realistically a person can’t spend significant amounts of time with members of every discreet group of people they might see on a daily basis.
The very existence of this comic points to a sad reality. Is it exaggerated? Probably. But it’s a damn cartoon, it’s supposed to be.
Sadly, statistics sort of tend to back up at least a few of those claims, even if it is a silly cartoon. Even if people do not like to admit it. Example, in 2018, 69% of black mothers are single mothers. But people never want to speak about reality because they have been told that speaking about reality is somehow racist, which is not. No problem ever gets fixed if people refuse to look at it, honestly.
“In 2011, 72% of black babies were born to unmarried mothers,[5][6] while the 2018 National Vital Statistics Report provides a figure of 69.4 percent for this condition.” The stats have not gotten better since then.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/African-American_family_structure
Around half of the US population has hypertension.
I’m guessing you wouldn’t want your doctor just assuming you have it and start treating it though.
The reason why stereotypes are bad is because even if there’s aggregate data trends on a broad population basis, that doesn’t necessarily translate to individualized specifics.
Statistically, black math scores are worse than white.
In my high school, I was in Calculus BC in my senior year, along with most of the other smartest kids in my grade.
One of the few black students at my prep school had been in that class in his junior year and for his senior year just sat one on one with the math teacher because he was a full year ahead of us. He was also the student that I used to get the most competitive with playing chess in the student lounge (because he was legit better than me and the few victories I’d eek out were actual accomplishments), and was the one of my friends to go off to Stanford.
It’d be a real shame if someone looking at him decided that based on broad statistics relating to the melanin in his skin that he wasn’t as good at math as someone with less melanin.
And personally, I’d think anyone making that leap of logic was a goddamn moron.
(Also, pro tip - it’s worth thinking about the differences between averages and distributions around those averages if you are going to make an argument for there being merit in extrapolating from statistics. For example, you are more likely to be told by a mother with a child that the father is not in the picture by a white mother than a black mother if you ask the question of every mother you see.)
I have to disagree with a reply to this before me because I think this example doesn’t do the comment about statistics mentioned above justice.
You don’t want your doctor to treat you for hypertension, but you want him to check you for it to catch it early if you have it if you fall into a category that makes it more likely you have hypertension. This does not mean he should ignore the possibility of a disease in a non-high-risk group either.
Equally, black students being statistically speaking worse at math does not mean you should look at a black student and assume he is bad in math. But it can mean that funding for programs targeted at helping minority students going to math tutoring can be better justified.
I will not argue that based on statistics you should make assumptions about people, hell no. This is obviously racist. But assuming statistics (and being aware of them) are first and foremost racist would just be equally wrong.
The phrasings in the meme can be described as racist. But the structural problems that racism created and that lead to these assumptions cannot be fought by ignoring them.
But this ignores the issue of frequency I hint at in the bottom parenthetical.
Let’s say for the sake of argument black students are 2x as likely as white students to fail a math class and need to retake it.
Breaking it out by racial cross tabs may well suggest a policy of adding a math support program exclusively for black students.
The problem is that at a frequency basis, (0.616 times X) > (0.121 times 2X). So your well intentioned program just excluded a greater number of students that are going to fail math than the number of students you are going to include.
A better approach would be to identify what students are struggling with math irrespective of their melanin, and ensure adequate resources are tailored to them.
The only way a melanin specific math program makes sense is if the specific factors relating to why a given student is struggling with math is unique to their melanin such that a broader program focused on math won’t address those issues.
But even in terms of unique causes or factors, my guess is that the melanin specific crosstab is a poor metric selection, as it simply correlates with multiple other factors which more closely track with performance, such as household income levels, parent availability at home, parent education levels, etc.
So a program that was focused instead on things like “math support for kids who don’t have a parent who has high school math level competency at home” is going to be much more successful for many more students than one focused on “students with a lot of melanin who are struggling with math.”
It’s a shitty metric that persists because it’s easy to classify and because for some things it is a causative factor in and of itself (such as criminal injustice).
I really like your hypertension/doctor example, it’s a useful way to frame things. Thanks for sharing.
I’m not sure but I don’t think the point is statistics. I think the point is to treat everyone equally despite the colour of their skin until you know them personally, and their situation.
Your quote doesn’t support your claim. 69% of black mothers being unmarried does not mean they’re single mothers. It definitely correlates, but one doesn’t mean the other.
deleted by creator
Unmarried and single are different things.
This sounds like one of those crime rate arguments for justifying racism without looking at any of the other factors.
Your choice of wording is odd, like “problem”, and “better.” I am 30 years old. I have been with my partner for 15 years, and we have an 8 and a 6 year old child together. We live together in our 4 bedroom home. Yes, we are black. No, there is no struggle associated with us being unmarried.
Congratulations on 15 years together.
In the US, there are legal and financial advantages to marrying your partner. It sounds like you’re in it for the long haul so it’s worth thinking about. Have a chat about it with your lawyer or accountant, they’ll make the case much better than I can.
Statistics show that white people are more likely to develop skin cancer than other racial groups. Would that problem be fixed by asking every white person you meet who has mole on their face if they have skin cancer?
It is racist/sexist/discriminatory to make assumptions on individuals based on statistics.
The statistics can still be true and can be used to counter discrimination against specific groups.
To expand a little I feel it’s more that people do not understand racism appropriately rather than not wanting to speak about reality. People, ironically, fear being labeled. For most racism is blatant and obvious. A “do not say or do these specific things” mentality. This leads to the misunderstanding. The reality (as you say) is we should acknowledge racism. By acting like it isn’t there we are doing a disservice to the people who are affected by the systemic issues that do exist.
In the U.S. this is very much a larger cultural issue, while also being a problem elsewhere in the world. If I had to guess: Cultures with stronger authoritarian leanings in significant sub-cultures such as work and familial structures also see stronger racism or similar beliefs on the same tree. How is this fought? Humility and acknowledgement.
However, this comic is largely talking about how stereotypes harm individuals…
Agreed. But I wonder if this is butting up against a limitation of the human brain. Every person across the globe experiences stereotypes. It seems to be a natural way the human brain forms initial judgements. Hell, I don’t think the comic artist realized they were making a stereotype when they made all the questions askers white.
Being aware of it helps but the best fix is to have a significant amount of personal time with the group in question. This is why it’s so frustrating for someone of a particular race to hear questions like this, because they have plenty of first hand experience with members of their race. Themselves, their family, etc…
But realistically a person can’t spend significant amounts of time with members of every discreet group of people they might see on a daily basis.
It’s not that exaggerated if you live in central Europe.