Iām not kidding. I donāt think you could explain the thing youāre taking issue with without projecting your ethical framework onto it.
We can have a conversation about effective/acceptable methods of activism without all this bullshit posturing. Just say the thing you mean and leave the agitprop to the activists.
Iām not kidding. I donāt think you could explain the thing youāre taking issue with
āI take issue with the presentation of all major sides of an issue to be indistinguishable because they are both flawed, with the implicit or explicit exhortation to support neither, when there are obvious and important differences between the two with one being unambiguously preferable, and choosing neutrality is siding with the oppressorā?
without projecting your ethical framework onto it.
What the ever-loving fuck would be describing a political issue without projecting an ethical framework onto it?
We can have a conversation about effective/acceptable methods of activism without all this bullshit posturing. Just say the thing you mean and leave the agitprop to the activists.
āāBothsidesā attitude is bullshit and, ultimately, right-wing bullshitā?
āI take issue with the presentation of all major sides of an issue to be indistinguishable because they are both flawed, with the *implicit or explicit exhortation to support neither, when there are obvious and important differences between the two with one being unambiguously preferable, and choosing neutrality is siding with the oppressorā?
Criticism of your party doesnāt āimplicitly exhortā support for neither, dipshit. Itās exactly this inference thatās the problem with your categorization scheme. Democracy canāt work when any and all dissent is filed under the same category as āopenly fascistā.
Both parties sharing a huge, glaring problem is a pretty valid reason to engage in dissenting speech.
What the ever-loving fuck would be describing a political issue without projecting an ethical framework onto it?
Thatās the fucking point. Having the disagreement is politics, but framing that disagreement as āoppositionā is willfully malicious and you know it.
āāBothsidesā attitude is bullshit and, ultimately, right-wing bullshitā?
Nah, man. I know full well youāve read MLK, donāt be the patronizing white-moderate. Both sides are shit, we should be arguing for changing that not just signing blank checks for the less objectionable one.
Criticism of your party doesnāt āimplicitly exhortā support for neither, dipshit.
I never said it did?
Both parties sharing a huge, glaring problem is a pretty valid reason to engage in dissenting speech.
ā¦ okay?
Thatās the fucking point. Having the disagreement is politics, but framing that disagreement as āoppositionā is willfully malicious and you know it.
Man, Iām not fucking talking about āAnyone who disagrees with the Demsā.
Nah, man. I know full well youāve read MLK, donāt be the patronizing white-moderate. Both sides are shit, we should be arguing for changing that not just signing blank checks for the less objectionable one.
I donāt disagree? At the same time, when it comes down to the metal, if those are your only two choices, you have to be prepared to bite the bullet and take a side, not say āBoth sides are the same!ā, which is what is being criticized here (in the meme, of self-proclaimed centrists, though, given Lemmyās makeup, the comments have predictably veered towards self-proclaimed leftists doing the same). When Nazi Germany comes a-knockinā, you side with the US, or the UK, or the USSR, regardless of what valid criticisms you have for each. Because there is a bigger enemy afoot, and thereās not an alternative option that doesnāt result in vast amounts of people living under fascism.
Iāve told people since the end of the election, if you want to start a third-party movement, now is exactly the time. Or if you want to do a revolution, now is the time to lay groundwork. Now is the time to decouple from the Dems, if youāre going to do it.
Iām not exactly a Dem partisan. I just recognized that in 2024, our realistic options were fascism or the Dems, shitty as they were, and of the two, thereās no real contest in which should have been preferable. Iām still pissed that my life is on the fucking line, not to mention the lives of millions of others, because a third of the country decided fascism was an okay alternative, since āboth sidesā were the same. And Iām pissed that I saw that sentiment here regularly, on Lemmy, from the mouths of supposed leftists.
Iām used to hearing it from ācentristsā, like in the meme. But if thereās one thing that Lemmy has taught me, itās that while leftists might be less repugnant than the general population, weāre not actually any smarter. Just as gullible, just as senseless, just as willing to engage in feel-good politics over reality.
Guess I knew that on an intellectual level, but hadnāt accepted it emotionally before I moved here.
Now is the time to decouple from the Dems, if youāre going to do it
Right, so why are we playing semantic games with categorizations when now is the time to be pointing out why the democrats are unelectable (while on the topic, that is why they lost to trump). The body politic moved out from underneath them and they didnāt react. It isnāt because some stubborn group of progressives were making a fuss about a pet issue. I donāt care if you wanna wring your hands that the republicans are a greater evil than the dems, i care that centrists (like, actual moderates who run cover for democrats by claiming their the only ārealisticā option, coughcough) keep turning their anger at the people pushing for the things they claim to support but never āwhen it comes down to the metalā.
But if thereās one thing that Lemmy has taught me, itās that while leftists might be less repugnant than the general population, weāre not actually any smarter.
Is leftist some fun outfit you put on sometimes when the weather suits you? Youāve been using this account for long enough I think most of us have you pegged as a warhawk liberal, not any kind of āleftistā - none I would ever care to work with, at least.
It isnāt because some stubborn group of progressives were making a fuss about a pet issue.
Thatās funny, because Iāve had numerous āleftistā posters tell me that the Dems lost because of progressives abstaining due to one pet issue or another. And whatās worse, theyāve backed their stance with data.
Is leftist some fun outfit you put on sometimes when the weather suits you? Youāve been using this account for long enough I think most of us have you pegged as a warhawk liberal, not any kind of āleftistā - none I would ever care to work with, at least.
The only war that Iāve been in support of since Iāve been on Lemmy has been the war in Ukraine against Russian imperialism and genocide.
Iām extremely anti-tankie, and donāt regard harm reduction as optional, unlike some purity-obsessed posters, but if thatās what makes me a warhawk liberal in your eyes, go off, I guess.
Thatās funny, because Iāve had numerous āleftistā posters tell me that the Dems lost because of progressives abstaining due to one pet issue or another.
Maybe they lost because they actively avoided addressing any issues.
The only war that Iāve been in support of since Iāve been on Lemmy has been the war in Ukraine against Russian imperialism and genocide.
The only war youāve concerned yourself with is a war that has the biggest geopolitical implications. In a certain light, this looks a little like youāre only really concerned with wars that have the biggest implications for western geopolitical soft power (which is absolutely true about Ukraine). If it were on the merits of āopposing imperialist ambitions and genocideā as the anti-tankie label suggests, I would think the genocide in gaza would at least rank, since Isrealās imperial ambitions and actions in Gaza and the middle east are far more recent, bloody, and asymmetrical than the war in Ukraine.
As an anarchist living in America, I have a whole lot of questions for anyone who strongly cares about the Russian invasion of Ukraine but doesnāt seem to give two shits about the imperial ambitions of a western ally in the ME. Maybe āwarhawkā isnāt quite the right term, but āleftistā is for sure not the right one.
You present far more like a career security advisor working out of the pentagon, but Iām not conspiratorial enough to seriously think that - tho it is interesting to think about.
Maybe they lost because they actively avoided addressing any issues.
There are many reasons why the Dems lost. Every one of them bears some blame, and most - though not all - of them are on the party leadership.
Unfortunately, the data provided by leftists on Lemmy has been very convincing in putting forward that even a single one - namely, leftists abstaining from voting Dem over their personal issue of choice - could have saved us from fascism. Instead, those selfsame leftists chose to embrace as much genocide as possible, killing literal millions, even just at current projections.
The only war youāve concerned yourself with is a war that has the biggest geopolitical implications.
The only war Iāve supported, not the only one Iāve concerned myself with.
I would think the genocide in gaza would at least rank, since Isrealās imperial ambitions and actions in Gaza and the middle east are far more recent, bloody, and asymmetrical than the war in Ukraine.
Iāve expressed deep opposition to Israelās ongoing genocide in Gaza, as well as their invasions of neighboring states.
Iāve openly stated opposition to all Israeli aid. Iāve denounced the idea that we should be allies at all with Israel, due to their horrific conduct.
As an anarchist living in American, I have a whole lot of questions for anyone who strongly cares about the Russian invasion of Ukraine but doesnāt seem to give two shits about the imperial ambitions of a western ally in the ME.
And you would be right to. Unfortunately for your argument here, that has nothing to do with me.
You present far more like a career security advisor working out of the pentagon, but Iām not conspiratorial enough to seriously think that - tho it is interesting to think about.
Jesus fucking Christ.
Iām not kidding. I donāt think you could explain the thing youāre taking issue with without projecting your ethical framework onto it.
We can have a conversation about effective/acceptable methods of activism without all this bullshit posturing. Just say the thing you mean and leave the agitprop to the activists.
āI take issue with the presentation of all major sides of an issue to be indistinguishable because they are both flawed, with the implicit or explicit exhortation to support neither, when there are obvious and important differences between the two with one being unambiguously preferable, and choosing neutrality is siding with the oppressorā?
What the ever-loving fuck would be describing a political issue without projecting an ethical framework onto it?
āāBothsidesā attitude is bullshit and, ultimately, right-wing bullshitā?
Criticism of your party doesnāt āimplicitly exhortā support for neither, dipshit. Itās exactly this inference thatās the problem with your categorization scheme. Democracy canāt work when any and all dissent is filed under the same category as āopenly fascistā.
Both parties sharing a huge, glaring problem is a pretty valid reason to engage in dissenting speech.
Thatās the fucking point. Having the disagreement is politics, but framing that disagreement as āoppositionā is willfully malicious and you know it.
Nah, man. I know full well youāve read MLK, donāt be the patronizing white-moderate. Both sides are shit, we should be arguing for changing that not just signing blank checks for the less objectionable one.
I never said it did?
ā¦ okay?
Man, Iām not fucking talking about āAnyone who disagrees with the Demsā.
I donāt disagree? At the same time, when it comes down to the metal, if those are your only two choices, you have to be prepared to bite the bullet and take a side, not say āBoth sides are the same!ā, which is what is being criticized here (in the meme, of self-proclaimed centrists, though, given Lemmyās makeup, the comments have predictably veered towards self-proclaimed leftists doing the same). When Nazi Germany comes a-knockinā, you side with the US, or the UK, or the USSR, regardless of what valid criticisms you have for each. Because there is a bigger enemy afoot, and thereās not an alternative option that doesnāt result in vast amounts of people living under fascism.
Iāve told people since the end of the election, if you want to start a third-party movement, now is exactly the time. Or if you want to do a revolution, now is the time to lay groundwork. Now is the time to decouple from the Dems, if youāre going to do it.
Iām not exactly a Dem partisan. I just recognized that in 2024, our realistic options were fascism or the Dems, shitty as they were, and of the two, thereās no real contest in which should have been preferable. Iām still pissed that my life is on the fucking line, not to mention the lives of millions of others, because a third of the country decided fascism was an okay alternative, since āboth sidesā were the same. And Iām pissed that I saw that sentiment here regularly, on Lemmy, from the mouths of supposed leftists.
Iām used to hearing it from ācentristsā, like in the meme. But if thereās one thing that Lemmy has taught me, itās that while leftists might be less repugnant than the general population, weāre not actually any smarter. Just as gullible, just as senseless, just as willing to engage in feel-good politics over reality.
Guess I knew that on an intellectual level, but hadnāt accepted it emotionally before I moved here.
Just stop.
Right, so why are we playing semantic games with categorizations when now is the time to be pointing out why the democrats are unelectable (while on the topic, that is why they lost to trump). The body politic moved out from underneath them and they didnāt react. It isnāt because some stubborn group of progressives were making a fuss about a pet issue. I donāt care if you wanna wring your hands that the republicans are a greater evil than the dems, i care that centrists (like, actual moderates who run cover for democrats by claiming their the only ārealisticā option, coughcough) keep turning their anger at the people pushing for the things they claim to support but never āwhen it comes down to the metalā.
Is leftist some fun outfit you put on sometimes when the weather suits you? Youāve been using this account for long enough I think most of us have you pegged as a warhawk liberal, not any kind of āleftistā - none I would ever care to work with, at least.
Thatās funny, because Iāve had numerous āleftistā posters tell me that the Dems lost because of progressives abstaining due to one pet issue or another. And whatās worse, theyāve backed their stance with data.
The only war that Iāve been in support of since Iāve been on Lemmy has been the war in Ukraine against Russian imperialism and genocide.
Iām extremely anti-tankie, and donāt regard harm reduction as optional, unlike some purity-obsessed posters, but if thatās what makes me a warhawk liberal in your eyes, go off, I guess.
Maybe they lost because they actively avoided addressing any issues.
The only war youāve concerned yourself with is a war that has the biggest geopolitical implications. In a certain light, this looks a little like youāre only really concerned with wars that have the biggest implications for western geopolitical soft power (which is absolutely true about Ukraine). If it were on the merits of āopposing imperialist ambitions and genocideā as the anti-tankie label suggests, I would think the genocide in gaza would at least rank, since Isrealās imperial ambitions and actions in Gaza and the middle east are far more recent, bloody, and asymmetrical than the war in Ukraine.
As an anarchist living in America, I have a whole lot of questions for anyone who strongly cares about the Russian invasion of Ukraine but doesnāt seem to give two shits about the imperial ambitions of a western ally in the ME. Maybe āwarhawkā isnāt quite the right term, but āleftistā is for sure not the right one.
You present far more like a career security advisor working out of the pentagon, but Iām not conspiratorial enough to seriously think that - tho it is interesting to think about.
There are many reasons why the Dems lost. Every one of them bears some blame, and most - though not all - of them are on the party leadership.
Unfortunately, the data provided by leftists on Lemmy has been very convincing in putting forward that even a single one - namely, leftists abstaining from voting Dem over their personal issue of choice - could have saved us from fascism. Instead, those selfsame leftists chose to embrace as much genocide as possible, killing literal millions, even just at current projections.
The only war Iāve supported, not the only one Iāve concerned myself with.
Iāve expressed deep opposition to Israelās ongoing genocide in Gaza, as well as their invasions of neighboring states.
Iāve openly stated opposition to all Israeli aid. Iāve denounced the idea that we should be allies at all with Israel, due to their horrific conduct.
And you would be right to. Unfortunately for your argument here, that has nothing to do with me.
Lord.