I’m interested in hearing what Lemmings think about hunting. I started hunting deer years ago because I wanted to be a part of the process, like if I couldn’t handle killing and gutting an animal I shouldn’t be eating meat. IMO, it’s much more humane than what factory farmed animals endure. Less suffering overall than most natural deaths. Overpopulation causes disease and starvation and we killed off their predators, so we kind of owe it to nature to fill the ecological gap.
Also, I fucking love it. I watch the sun rise, think, record birds I’ve seen, think, watch squirrels play, think a bit more, and sometimes, I get some food.
Idk. I’m not looking for approval or trying to change your mind, just wondering what people think.
I actually kind of dont like it as a past time. Its just very time consuming. Its an early morning activity if you want to maximise your chances. It takes a lot of focus too, which i can struggle with.
Doing it with friends and family, getting to immerse myself in the less tended to parts of the land, and getting food for me and everyone is what makes it worth it to me. Its also a little humbling if you are doing it legally and being a good sport about it, which is good chance to respect our other brothers and sisters as they are and not just as objects or fiction.
From a ecological managment standpoint, taking of areas so an herbavore herd can safely graze on non-crops and help maintain that part of the ecosystem is really cool to. Not everything can be industrialized (in fact i think we should deindustrialize a lot of the food industry, but that is a tough path), but also not space for wildlife can be kilometers away from any human structure (though more space would be good for our planet too).
Hunting for food is OK, as long as proper technique is observed (safe, humane, environmentally responsible).
Hunting for fun is a sociopath’s pastime.
I’ve never wanted to do it myself, but am very appreciative when hunter buddies share the carcasses of their victims. :)
“If we weren’t supposed to eat animals, they wouldn’t be made of meat.” – Socrates, probably
We fucked up the wolf populations so its our moral imperative to control deer populations.
We should bring the wolves back.
Im trying but they city keeps sending animal control to stop them from huntinh the neighborhood. /s
Just messing with you. It is cool to see there reintroduction into wilderness areas but there is a reason people killed or domesticated the apex predators living nearing people, pets, and live stock.
I live in an area with an out of control whitetail deer population. I don’t have it in me to hunt, but I’m all for people deer hunting to curb the population. Most folks I know who hunt also eat their kills or give away/sell the meat, so it isn’t wasted. A lot of local craftspeople use deer hide and antlers for knife making and stuff and there’s soooo many taxidermists. Almost every butcher shop around offers deer processing, too.
When I was a kid way out in the boonies, the wild coyote population boomed and the pack actively started hunting me and other small kids and killing livestock like crazy. The folks in the surrounding areas thinned the pack when the game commission wouldn’t do something about the problem. I was totally fine with that hunting too because I didn’t like coyotes stalking me and preventing me from playing outside.
I know some people who pheasant hunt and it’s never bothered me because, again, the corpses aren’t wasted.
My grandpa crow hunted and he took me with him once and II had researched crows beforehand because I was excited. I learned how smart they are and refused to let my grandpa shoot them. We just sat there and watched them hang out and figure out the decoys we had set up.
From Europe, I share your Arguments although I am vegan. I would however prefer to get natural predators back and not controlling populations by hunting so they fit into the modern agricultural understand of “enough”.
Yes, wolves in the suburbs is a great idea, nobody will be upset about that
I never was really interested, though plenty of people in my family hunt. In Arkansas while I was in secondary school, we did all have to take a mandatory Hunter’s Safety course. And, in the area were I live right now, I’m sure there are families that benefit from the additional caloric supply, maxing out their tags during rifle season.
I have mixed feelings around the other points you raise, that I find it hard to articulate. But, I don’t have any better solution to overpopulation.
I’ve been present at killing, cleaning, and (later) butchering of rabbit, deer and cow. But, I do try to get as few calories from animal products as I can. I was vegan at home for many months, tho not currently.
I don’t think the solution to the predators being gone is for humans to fill the gap, rather to let the predators make a return.
Here in Sweden we’re looking to shoot most of our wolves for no good reason. That is after a considerable effort to stabilise the population and bring genetic diversity back to it.
Not practical in most places. Wolves have a huge range and deer are everywhere. Nobody wants wolves in the suburbs.
Thing is, we’re twice the size of Germany, with like one sixth of the population. Germany has around 1600 wolves throughout, and we can’t cope with 350?
I highly doubt it. The problem is that we have a bunch of farmers that don’t care to properly secure their livestock so they whine really loudly and then the wolves get it.
The goal is to reduce it to 170.
If humanity subsisted off hunted food, we would eat the last wild animal before the first afternoon of the first day. Hunting is a selfish, needlessly cruel, unsustainable practice.
Hunting for sport and trophies is bad, but hunting for meat is a hell of a lot more ethical than industrial meat production. Interestingly I’ve known people that were Vegan due to the ethics of commercial animal handling, but were also hunting and would eat meat from animals killed in the hunting team.
I live in Sweden and hunting is pretty common here, even though I’m not personally involved. There are limits on when and how many animals you may shoot and when to make sure the population is healthy.
Hunting with a valid reason (for food, population control, etc.) is acceptable and/or a necessity.
Hunting for funsies only - including all the BS safari hunting that are essentially glorified high tech fishing trips - is disgusting
BS safari hunting funds conservation in ways that are unachievable otherwise
Well, then this funding source should not be pursued
Then animals die, populations drop, restoration programs end
Not if the funding is made up somewhere else?
It isn’t though, which is why conservation groups that hunt are a net positive in practice. The members also tend to discourage poaching, push harder for maintaining ecosystems, and other stuff beyond what funding can do on its own because the individuals who tend to be involved have ofher forms of influence and power.
It sucks that this is how the world works, but in this specific case it works.
Yeah, I’m less so making at argument about what is currently happening, and more just saying that I would prefer a world in which we fund conservation differently, and we should try to move things in that direction
Two kinds of people typically hunt endangered animals: rich assholes and starving people. A straight ban on hunting these animals does nothing to solve either problem.
We know rich assholes are going to do what they want by whatever means, including exploiting animals and the poor, so I don’t think I need to go into that.
Poor people will hunt endangered animals or take rich people to hunt them because both those paths lead to them and their families eating. They may care about the animals, they may not, but they and their families need food and money to live.
Legalized hunting of endangered game does a lot to solve all these problems. Poor people become legitimate guides. Poachers in places like Tanzania were for a while allowed to be killed legally. Now they aren’t shot for trying to provide food for people and are putting the money into their villages. The people now have economic incentive to protect these animals to protect their new local tourism. Associated services are created to make the destination attractive. Governments see the benefit of monitoring and protecting these species.
It’s not perfect. Anti-poaching measures leads to violence on both sides, just as things like the war on drugs. Things like legalized gambling, drugs, and prostitution help prevent exploitation, keeps participants safer in their activities, and allows monitoring and oversight by regulators. Some will still poach no matter what. But it brings more things to the open and people can work with facts and figures about their local situations.
I don’t like the idea of trophy hunting anymore than I like seeing people participate in other senseless and destructive vices, but we can ensure people do things in ways that are better and safe for all involved.
I do hunt for one deer a year myself. Where I am has a higher number than is sustainable, and with people having less money and time off than ever, the state cannot get all the deer they want to be hunted as things are. It lets me take one animal that gets me through most of the year instead of however many from the store, and I know it’s all natural and never spent a moment in captivity. Hunting is mostly a chore for me, though I do enjoy the time in the woods and spending a few days with my brother.
There’s an incredible Radio Lab episode called “the rhino hunter” that deep dives into this fact, and it’s honestly one of the most emotionally confusing pieces of media I’ve ever encountered. Highly recommend.
“Man, this baby grinding machine sure eats a lot of babies, but think of all the money it generates!”
I won’t cry if anyone dies while hunting, but i do love venison
Are people shopping for hamburger at Safeway considered hunters?
Shooting a deer that’s lived wild and free, making every effort to make the kill as quick and painless as possible seems like just about the most ethical way to get meat that I can think of. And especially in areas where the deer population is too high, it’s really important for managing the ecosystem. Plus, ammo and equipment sales get taxed specifically to fund conservation, which is important.
I also feel like if you can’t stomach the process of killing and cleaning an animal, maybe you shouldn’t eat meat at all?
By and large, I think hunting for food is a great way to get more in touch with where your food comes from, one of the most ethical ways to acquire meat, and a nice excuse to sit quietly in the woods without interruption. Trophy hunters can fuck off tho.
I can accept trophy hunting for population control, but I will still think less of them for wanting to do it
Instead of killing, try a trip just to photograph the animals. Then compare your experiences. The killing may not be what you enjoy about your hunting trips.
I tried that once but the photographs tasted aweful.
I’ve worked in wildlife conservation, and I’m all for it. With a few caveats.
- Be a fucking good shot. Practice. Don’t slop and wound. Humane kills to the greatest extent possible. Know what the fuck you’re doing.
- Eat the meat. Venison is delicious. Harvest, don’t just take a trophy.
- No spears. Holy shit, please. See point 1. Why is this still a thing? Even a niche thing, but still.
- Don’t scoff at tag prices. Be proud of your contribution. Donate to the crunchy granola hippies that ensure you have game to hunt.
I’m lucky to live somewhere with too many deer and not enough hunters. I paid $25 and got six tags. Another $25 for gun season and I could theoretically take a dozen.
Also have a degree in wildlife conservation and I second all of this.
Venison IS delicious.
I’m just realizing I haven’t had any venison since I moved out of parent’s house. Dad was a poor hunter but my cousin was a good one so there was always some meat in the fall.
If you ask around, you might be surprised who has some in their freezer and would be willing to trade something else for it. One time when I was visiting my parents we wanted some and asked around and found out one of my mom’s friends had plenty. Traded them a pan of brownies and bottle of wine for a couple pounds of stew meat. Everyone was a winner.
I live in the SF Bay Area now. Not a lot deer hunting in Oakland.
edit - parents live in upstate NY where the deer population needs to be kept in chek.
Deer are farmed, too. You can just buy venison at fancy butcher shops in many large cities.
Or, maybe you’ve heard about buying things online.
https://www.blackwing.com/venison.html
https://meatnbone.com/collections/venison
Finding venison isn’t an impossible task by any stretch of the imagination.
