it has been for like 20+years, thats around the time they were giving participation grades for people to pass HS. with AI/ absent parenting it has only gotten worst. likewise with mathematics too. and people doing arithmetic courses in cc is a sign, eventhough its not as useful as algebra anyways.
Yes I’m sure it’s those and unrelated to chronic under funding, under staffing, and socioeconomic decline.
The horror stories about common core are evangelical right wing propaganda in their war on pubic education. They still teach algebra in K-12.
Screens. Its screens. Dont five them a device. Give them a book and have the teacher teach them how to read. Slow them down and remove distractions.
I love mobile tech. I’ve been using it for years, I’ve advocated for its use, recommended it to others, helped many set it up. And as much as I really HATE to say it, I was wrong.
To be fair- the problem isn’t the tech, the problem is the applications- social media ‘scrolling’ apps and short form video to be specific. But these days those apps are basically impossible to separate from phones and iPads.
And when the asshole algorithm based attention seekers (Meta, TikTok, Google, etc) came around, I and those like me had given them all a direct mainline IV into peoples eyeballs. We had good intentions- we never wanted mobile tech to become this. We never saw it coming. But we should have.
Unfortunately @[email protected], at this point I think your answer is the only one we’ve got left. I’ve seen what passes for ‘kid friendly’ on an iPad- bright colors, happy music, think CocoMelon in an app. Or worse, short form videos- we let our kids spend 6 hours a day watching 30 second videos, and then wonder why they can’t focus in class for more than 45 seconds. Yeah there’s no porn, but it might as well be digital crack cocaine for the brain.
So yeah, at this point I think for our own good we need to roll this back like a failed update. Go back to dead-tree books and textbooks, or at the very least, downgrade to E-Ink or monochrome LCD so the screen is less engaging than the real world, not more.
Finally, and most importantly, we need to re-evaluate our relationship with boredom. Boredom sucks, but it also leads to inspiration and creativity. Scrolling apps essentially eliminate boredom, because however much time you have to kill, there’s always more content to fill it. And I think that’s a bad thing- we need a little boredom.
Same thing. Before my sister had kids i thoght it’s important that children learn their way around computers and while just giving them an ipad isn’t ideal, it certainly isn’t that bad.
But i thimk every sane person who has ever seen an ipad kid, ralises that they are truly cooked beyond repair. When my nephew was like 5, there was a christmas party abd there were 3 kids aged 3-6. I put my phone on the table and went to do something. There is nothing going on, except that it ahowed the time and maybe MAYBE a notification. These kids sat around my phone like the monkeys around the obelisk in 2001. I told them to not touch it and tried to explain that to them, it’s nothing but a watch, and they have seen a watch. It did not matter at all. Their eyes were widened by the shiny object and they could’t not touch it. I told them to keep their hands off, and they said they PROMISE not to touch it. And their hands immediately started to move on their own, slowly aproching that forbidden object. They did not care about christmas anymore or gifts or relatives, they juat sat there and waited for the time to change. Back then, they didn’t even know what is even on that thing, but they knew that grown ups are constantly glued to it.
The other thing that i witnessed once was in a store, it was pretty busy and there was this kid in the middle of an isle, maybe 6-8 years old. He was sitting in a shopping cart, playing fortnite. He did not care at all that he was in the way. He got bumped into several times by annoyed customers. He never looked up, even once. I was pretty annoyed too, but at the parents, i felt pretty bad for the guy. So i went to grab the cart and pushed him to the side. That kid never looked up, did not care that he juat got pushed around, did not care that i was a complete stranger.
Last but not least, my girlfriend’s daughter is now 8 years old. She’s addicted to reading, super intelligent child. She hardly ever used a phone, and doesn’t really watch tv. (Not because she doesn’t want to, it’s just a house rule.) Her grandmother is one of the biggest pieces of shits i have ever seen. I despise that lady with every fiber of my being. She tries so hard to break these children. She promised to gift that 8 year old a phone, multiple times. As a parent, you are then the asshole who have to explain your child that they absolutely do not get a phone. And that boomer cunt says shit like: oh it’s fine, she’ll get a new phone so she can have the old one. Then she can whatsapp people and use instagram and tiktok. Like what the fuck, are you crazy? So long story short, she still things that 8 year old, higly intelligent kid needs a phone, and it’s getting on everyone’s nerves, so the compromise was that she got a “play phone” a real ass phone with nothing on. Not even a cgarge. It’s just a blank piece of glass and plastic to play with. Seeing her walking around with that thing and “taking selfies” and “using social media” is such a dystopian thing. Even that blank thing causes so much friction, it’s insane. It became her emotional support object, abd she sometimes gets in trouble because she doesn’t put it away on the table and shit. And it also got smashed to bits the first day she got it, because… Children and glass.
Tl;dr I’m now a phone bad boomer abd i’ll die on that hill
Here’s the thing- kids should ‘know their way around computers’. But an iPad DOESN’T do that.
I think you might appreciate this blog post: Kids can’t use computers… and this is why it should worry you IMHO this is worth the time to read it.
Consider the tech that was available in the 2000s and early 2010s. There was a lot of innovation, but if you wanted to make it work you had to figure it out. For example- okay you bought a computer, want Internet? You have to find and hire an ISP, make sure your computer has an Ethernet port (adding one if it doesn’t), and hook it up. Want to use two computers at once? You need a router, it’s on you to select, purchase, and configure this thing. Want to get email on your PalmPilot? You gotta figure out your POP3/IMAP and SMTP server settings. Computer not working? Better look up error codes or reinstall Windows.
The result was that ‘digital natives’ who truly understood general purpose computers not just on a superficial operator level but on a technician level.
Then we decided to make it simple. Want a computer? Plug it in, it Just Works. Want to get online? Go down to the Apple store and plunk down $400 you’ve got an iPad and you’re online.
Result is the ‘digital natives’ are just skilled operators, and haven’t the slightest clue what’s going on.
Now for what they know, they ARE good with it. I was once in a car with such a kid, and there was some strange scene playing out on the sidewalk with an obviously drunk guy. Kid videoed this on the iphone. I joked that when we get home we should get some music and make a meme video. Kid goes head down, 45 seconds later comes up and shows me it’s been edited into a publish-ready video with a title and background music. But ask that kid where to find a filesystem and you’d probably get an answer like ‘in the drawer under my teacher’s desk’.My point is- I don’t think a kid should have an ipad, I think they should have an experience like early 2000s-2010s kids had. No plug and play devices. Instead things that if they want to make it work they have to figure it out themself.
Maybe the answer is some kind of raspberry pi based system but give it to them as a bag of parts and they have to assemble it themself into some kind of cyberdeck type setup, load an OS onto it (for this they get a blank laptop with an OS install stick, they have to install it themself to make it work enough to flash the Pi SD card).Maybe if Linux phones start to be a thing, the answer becomes give the kid the phone but with the memory wiped so they have to image it themself in order to make it work…
Or just give the kid a flip phone (feature phone, not foldable smartphone)- it can text and communicate and call 911 and that’s all you NEED.
MIL sounds insufferable and toxic AF-- even if you are a batshit crazy Luddite (although the Luddites may not have been so crazy, but I digress…) Even if you are a nut, it’s still your fucking kid, not hers. And that means she has no right to make parenting decisions.
You ever read Fahrenheit 451? This reminds me of the guy’s wife Mildred, who’s obsessing over the stupid brain dead TV drama and she wants to replace all 4 walls of a room with TVs to watch the show in surround. And the highlight of her character’s experience is when she goes interactive and they’re asking her if their party should be in the pink room or the blue room. Meanwhile she can’t possibly understand why her husband doesn’t care about any of this.
Your MIL sounds like Mildred.
Yay Mississippi, I guess?
Also in Europe. It’s obviously related to unrestricted internet use and smart phone proliferation.
They think they are smarter though. Beacause Tiktok told them so.
The inconvenient truth for us old shits is that the parents are at fault mostly. Mostly we were powerless to stop it of course, but also many of us used our own money and our own will to buy our kids those devices and then let them use them freely.
Besides flaws in supposed more modern methods of teaching (personally I fucking hate rote memorization, it is boring), too many distractions aka entertainment options more than ever. Especially on mobile devices.
And then you have the looming gap between the haves and the have-nots, and the have-nots are being taken advantage of by not opposing the system that’s oppressing them, such as deliberately making them unlearned.
Only fanatical bookworms do visit book fairs and defend public libraries from being dismantled.
Wtf is going on in Vermont in particular?
Vermont is poor and mostly rural. It has seen poor economic growth the last decade and residents have been leaving the state in droves. It was gutted by the rising of AirBNB rentals and then the pandemic.
Most of the economy is just rich people going there to vacation, who have drastically shot up the cost of living, prices out the locals, just like Colorado and other outdoor recreation areas. A lot of the local places were also bought up my Vale, etc.
MAGA!
What about the other 12 states?
I like to think that Oregon isn’t included because it shifts the curve too aggressively. To the left.
I would like to know what’s the influence of first generation immigration in these charts, because the states are kind of shit at reporting that.
My kids speak Spanish. They can read in both Spanish and English, but they learned Spanish first, so it took them a while to catch up in English. Many of their classmates come from Spanish speaking families, English is their second language, and they have a bit more of trouble. The issue here is that state level standardized testing doesn’t seem to care about Spanish at all, so you may find a bunch of very smart kids who score below average just because they speak more than one language, which is frankly insane.
Something like 22% of the US speaks something other than English at home. I wonder how this plays a role. I have no data beyond this, but it’s just something I’ve wondered about.
My kids district is a diverse one, I think white is just barely the majority, and it’s a real smattering of all sorts otherwise. There are a lot of kids who come from parents who clearly speak no English. And so when test results come out, they don’t look great for the school, but it’s kinda like no shit, we have kids learning English for the first time, of course they won’t test well.
So for this reason, I see how my kids are doing, I read with them, I do math with them, and if things seem good then they seem good, and I’m not personally going to stress over test score trends schoolwide, and certainly not statewide or nationally.
The US is working its way toward illiteracy. Republicans need this to install a permanent set of oligarchs in the government.
Mississippi making massive gains. lol
All this happened during the departments of education participation trophy era.
Trump’s racist policies are the cause of that
Seeing this chart gave me a headache, who made that shit? There has to be a more legible way to display this info!
I thought this was a great way to display it
I believe the point of this version is to show the magnitude of change. They could have done a line graph with the same data but that would give different information perspective. It’s not as visually appealing this way but this is how metrics are evaluated.
Less education funding. Inflation. Schools closing. Low teacher pay. Large class sizes. National funding being tied to standardized testing.
Whenever school funding is on the ballot in my state, it rarely passes. Kids and teachers do not have the resources they need to be successful and it will continue to get worse until the president makes it a point to improve it. This is far from a new problem though. The government wants our nation to be full of people with below average intellect. I don’t see any other reason not to invest in everyone’s future.
It’s not just financial though. Mississippi spends around $12k per student, and Oregon spends about $17k - that’s over 40% more per kid. California spends $24k. The way we do schools needs to be fixed top-to-bottom
You’re probably right. I just hate that teachers have to ask for basic school supply donations to do their job. For example, glue sticks aren’t something a kindergarten teacher should ever need to worry they will run out of. Give these people the resources to be successful. What do you think needs to change?
Man, I don’t know. A lot of the extra expenditure is probably going to special needs services and new educational tech/programs. Between the two, in more skeptical of the latter. Walk into any kindergarten around here and you’ll see big screen TVs in front and an iPad for each kid. I’m sure the bigger expense is licensing the “Alpha-friends” show or whatever and I’d love to see that go.
I also think COVID was hugely disruptive - not only to the kid’s learning but also to parent expectation that their kids try in school - Oregon has terrible parental support of kid attendance and learning. Parents need to blame their kids for failing more
As for solutions, I think we need to scrap No Child Left Behind. Leave kids behind in their last grade until they pass - I think MS did that, some say to inflate the scores. Loading teachers with students that don’t have a foundation makes it worse for everyone. Tying standardized test scores to funding also turns a metric into a target and worsens thing.
I don’t know man. It sucks and I’m just an idiot on the 'verse, but after seeing the ‘whole language’ approach fail so hard, I’m also skeptical of experts
It seems like the bad education is by design (minus Covid times). I think an instant improvement people would see would be to fund the hiring of more teachers and ensure teachers are all making a decent wage.
If we are to keep class sizes 20-30 students then it would be appropriate to have 2-3 teachers in the classroom. I’m mainly referring to elementary schools here because kids need time to develop focus and studying skills.
Extra staff gives students the opportunity to get more person teaching when needed and also allows teachers more free time to focus on teaching. If a teacher had to get to school early to oversee students on the playground before school, then helps with drop off/pickup after school and then has to go home and grade papers that night, they won’t have time and energy to improve their lessons. The system as a whole seems broken but I’m just an idiot like yourself lol. This is my outside perspective.
